Russell) Edwin Burrows (You be the Judge!)
New Jun 08, 06: Here's the information
released by the NATIONAL ARCHIVES AND RECORDS ADMINISTRATION (Click on the
thumbnail): US Air force; served from Aug 5, 52 thru Mar 23, 54 (20
Months); Rank/Grade: Airman 3rd Class; Military Education: A&E Mechanic;
Decorations/Awards: National Defense Service Medal (That's all folks!)
(12/9/05 6:46 pm)
setting a trap
This past weekend I prepared phony military orders which had
glaring mistakes. I sent that paper to a person in hopes that he would
pass it on and it would wind up in the hands of another person and
that he would use it as was hoped. It did and he did. Legal
preparations are being made now to bring this person to court. Legal
action will be taken here in Colorado so that the intended person will
have to travel here and hire and attorney here. The time has come to
shut this individual down and that is mine and my attorneys plan.
Also, from this point forward, I will no longer post any personal
information about myself. If any of you have a question other than
WHEN ask it. As for the when, you all know as much as I do.
--Claims to be a SOG veteran and even
produced a set of orders assigning to him to 5TH Special Forces, 5th SOG (a
non-existing unit) one year before SOG was ever created; however, he's is not
listed in Who's Who from MACVSOG, no one in SOG knows him. His credentials
appear fraudulent on their face. See all the discussions regarding this
candidate below. HE IS EXPOSED HERE FOR THE WORLD TO SEE!
See SOG DISCUSSON ON BURROW'S CLAIM TO
BE A SOG VETERAN
He sent out the above photo, the photo is a reversed image, what Col would ever
make this error? He does not wear Paratrooper wings, thus it is highly suspect
he was not Special Forces Qualified
IN MY OPINION, BASED ON THE
INFORMATION HE HAS DISSEMINATED, HE IS A COMPLETE FRAUD-RLNoe
Background of Russel Burrows of Olney, Ill.
1935 Born 1935, Richwood, West Virginia. Parents were
Earl. V. Burrows (Deceased) Amanda J. Burrows
1952 Graduated from High School 1952 Enlisted in U.S. Army
1952 Sent to Korea 1952
1953 Commissioned (Battlefield Commission) or cannon fodder.
Wounded twicw, Decorated five times, 1 Bronze Star, 2 Silver stars, 1
Legion of Merit, 2 Purple Hearts US Disability. Repatriated to Continental
U.S. Promoted to 1st Leutenant. Took and passed U.S. Army
OfficersQualification, retained Commission.
Went inactive to attend college 2 years at West Virginia University majoring
1955 Reactivated, sent tp Advanced Ranger training in
guerilla warfare. Posted in Leopold in South Africa to help put down
1960 Applied for and accepted for Special Forces Training,
1961 Posted in Siagon.
1963 Returned to the United States.Resigned Commission
(The above order he sent out have him
assigned to 5th S.O.G.[A non-existing unit] well before SOG was established on
16 January 1964 with numerous errors)
Acknowledgement: We have no knowledge of any claims to
mines or gold that this guy claims to have found, we are addressing only his
claims to have been a SOG veteran, but once a proven liar always a liar-His
creditability isn't worth a damn and any claim(s) he makes should be taken as
such, regardless of what it is!--RLNoe
I'm told he is smart and conniving, but he is as stupid
as a cold rock that's been pissed on when those who are in the know about his
alleged claims of being a SOG veteran is concerned--RLNoe
He claimed to have found a cave filled with
treasure in 1982 and has used this claim and his claim to have been in the
military/CIA, sell artifacts from a cave and holds seminars across the
country. Numerous investment corporations have been formed since
1982 (Illinois and Florida) to help "excavate" the cave southwest of Helm in
Marion County, Illinois and hundreds of thousands of dollars have been
'excavated' from the gullible and the greedy, yet, the cave's location (and
excavation) remains a secret.
Russell would have you believe that he removed
several thousand rock artifacts from the cave, yet he left the gold,
statues, diamonds, scrolls, skeletons and crypts untouched.
Does the cave even exist and has the parties
involved perpetuated an ongoing fraud and scam for the last 23 years without
any type of investigation by law enforcement; local, state or federal.
His name and current address:
Russell Edwin Burrows
117 Chestnut Street
Windsor, CO. 80550
telephone 970 686-0785
Formerly of Olney,
IL. In the event you call him, his phone only accepts calls that can be Caller
For more on this character and his Cave claims,
see the many websites, especially this one:
The above link is a web archive of a former website maintained by two other
cave associates of his, Brian Boyd Hubbard aka Harry Hubbard and Paul A. Kelly
aka Paul Schaffranke. They took the page down. Unknown to them their pages
were archived by a second party before they took them down.
who have submitted comments regarding Burrows are receiving the following
email from a "Whyte Eagle" who turns out to be a "Shawn Davis" and has
several websites that Burrows turns up on. Mr. Davis is in the "Ancient
Lost Treasure" business.
Let me begin with my apologies for this unsolicited email, but I am
looking into a matter you may have some experience with. I'm researching
the history of Russell Burrows and the claims he has made of his service
in certain branches of the military. I came across a statement with
your name on it at http://www.macvsog.cc/sog_hall_of_shame-phonies.htm
and have included it below for your reference. Again I apologize for this
email, but I was wondering if you could take a minute and help me out …
First I'd like to know if the statement below is in fact one you made or
Secondly is there anything else you might be willing to share which would
help me out in my research on this topic?
Thank you so much for your help in this matter,
I sent an email to Mr.
Davis and received the following in reply:
I work with the Ancient Historical Research Foundation (AHRF)
http://www.AncientHistoricalResearchFoundation.com which is a group
who researches ancient history and related items of interest. I came to
learn of what is known as “Burrows Cave” as a result of our research
into Ancient Civilizations, as you may know Russell Burrows is generally
accredited with first discovering the cave, hence the name “Burrows
Cave”. I also moderate a forum where topics like this are discussed (http://www.AncientLostTreasures.com)
… The fact that the cave was discovered 20+ years ago with no
substantial evidence ever coming forth has sparked a lot of discussion
on the topic. Russell Burrows has participated in some of these
discussions, and has posted on the forum. Recently, someone brought up
the military service of Russell Burrows and this has been tossed around
on the forum as well which eventually lead me to finding the SOG
website. The information which is displayed there is helpful in
understanding this back ground somewhat, but I didn’t know how authentic
the emails were that are listed as part of the SOG website. So my first
interest was to verify that the emails were legitimate, then second to
ask for any other information which would help me understand the
background history better. The bottom line for me is the cave itself,
the research into whether or not it truly exists, if it does exist then
it will have some significant impact on portions of the early American
History, and if not, well … then I guess it’s just a good story … Like I
mentioned earlier that as of right now we have no significant evidence
that it is real, and focus in the on going investigation is centering on
the Discoverer Russ Burrows … Hope that helps in understanding the
reason for my inquiry …. I sincerely appreciate the help I have received
so far in this matter from you and others listed there on the SOG site …
Please feel free to contact me anytime with any questions you may have …
More on Whyte Eagele/Burrows websites
INPUT FROM THE SOG COMMUNITY:
He is not listed as having ever
served with SOG, not listed in the Who's Who form MACVSOG and no one in Special
Forces has ever heard of this guy. During the 1963 time frame, there were only
two Colonels in Special Forces, he certainly wasn't either of them and SOG had
not been created at this time. There was no General in Special Forces Warfare
Center so how did he get a General to sign his orders? Had he ever been in
Special Forces or SOG with his claimed rank, he would have been well known among
our community. Cpt Robert L. Noe, USA, SOA/SFA/NOBC
Sherman, 5th Speical Forces and SOG Historian says: "Call Dan Rather and
Mary Mapes. Give them the scoop."
FROM THE SOG AND SPECIAL FORCES
This one does not look anything like the one I
KNEW! Would have replied sooner, however, sometime during my
uncontrollable laughing I pissed my pants and fainted...just came to !
Holy Balls ! ! What next ?
The one (phony) I worked with (briefly) was constantly
bragging about his exploits in S.E.A. . One day he had to take some time
off to go to the V.A. for a check-up. Stated he had a steel plate in his
head as a result of some type of action in Cambodia. I questioned him
about it and his statement was like so many others "can't really talk about
it" I was a Navy seal and the mission was Top Secret (sound Familiar) ?
He went on to say that he was a LCDR in the Navy - the shit just kept getting
deeper! I let it go on and figured he would make a mistake - HE DID !
He said the wrong thing about my wife one day and bingo. I said to
myself either I punch this bastard or bring him down in front of
everyone.....I tried the latter. I found out what I wanted to know but
it did not seem to have much of an effect on the hordes that already had this
High-Priest image of the prick. He climbed a steep ladder on the bones
of many and lied all the way...I managed to get my hands on the information
normally contained on DD214's. Imagine this - for a brief second, just
by the looks of this guy I thought he could be real...he looked 10 years older
than me - he was 10 years younger. Had NEVER been to Vietnam or any
other country (except in his mind). When I asked him about the LCDR part
he said he was given a Direct Commission - holy shit, all the way to LCDR
(Major)!. this didn't sound right given his age. He then stated he
was considered Genius and graduated from Penn State when he was 16.. No
Genius, just a CON-MAN. Exposed - Maybe, but like I said - he was
already entrenched in the minds of some of his followers and nothing was ever
going to change that - even the fact that he never finished BOOT CAMP and his
total time in service was less than 10 months. He's not one of our
wannabes, but in this instance let's at least make him an honorary asshole!
The orders for this guy was never printed at Ft Bragg or anywhere else that was
an official part of the Army, let along SF and Training.
CIA and SF were never issued any orders with joint mention, let alone TS without
any distribution symbols etc., this guy is a phony and so are these so called
TS orders or any document TS would have to have control numbers, stamped at both
top and bottom TS plus a distribution schedule at the bottom of the text.
Downgrading instructions would apply also. Hand carried by a courier. There are
to many mistakes on these orders. Such as the date and subject. etc. If this guy
is still around, those fake orders should land him some time in the ole jail
house where he belongs.
|This from Burrows in response to Duh Bear's email:
From: Randy 01/11/06
Here's a new twist, used to E&E being pegged as a Wannabee!!
I just got this from Burrows.
Note: If you are not familiar with "Illinois State Militia," it
is a State organization, designed to take the place of the state's
National Guard if the Guard is federalized. Sort of a "Home Guard"
kind of operation. NOT Federally funded, no Federal mission, no
Federal oversight, no Federal recognition.
From: "Russell Burrows" <firstname.lastname@example.org>
Since you are the first on the "phoney" web page, I will e-mail you.
No where and at no time have I ever claimed to have been a member of
the Special Forces or S.O.G. I was not!
The "orders" which were sent for inspection were written by me
with glaring mistakes were intended to help me determine rather or
not a certain person could be trusted with important information
Burrows Cave. When I JPGed that paper to him, I also telephoned him
and told him that the paper was intended for him only. This was, as
I said, to determine if I could trust him. I found that I could not.
A public statement was posted the following day on a public forum to
The photograph of me wearing a uniform is some how reversed but, I
have never seen that photograph before. It is not, I repeat, NOT a
U.S.Army uniform. It is one of the uniforms worn by the re-activated
Illinois State Militia.
Again, let me state: I was never a member of the Special Forces and
have never claimed to be such nor will you find any place that I
made such a claim.
If you and your associates are relying on the writtings of Rick
Flavin, then you are relying on a person who is not considered to be
a solid investigator and is considered to be a rabble rouser. You
people really need to be certain of your charges before you make
I am just as American as anyone posting on your web page and I
highly resent the implications made by some that I am not.
I trust that you will pass this e-mail on to your associates.
Russell EUGENE Burrows
In a message dated 11/26/2005 10:38:51 A.M. Central Standard Time, SOG1RLNOE
Could you tell me if the military issued paper orders like these back in 63?
No, It Should read:
UNITED STATES ARMY
JOHN F. KENNEDY CENTER FOR SPECIAL WARFARE (AIRBORNE)
Fort Bragg, North Carolina 28307
And orders would have been classified "FOR OFFICIAL USE ONLY"
First point, if this guy was to begin any conversation about any of his
"qualifications", I would go to the latrine and not return. Everything is
backward. As if photo negative has been reversed.... or some one was looking at
a photo while attaching devices etc Order of awards are all incorrect. As you
stated, the name tag is not right Paper orders are like none I ever saw.
Documents from a Generals Office would have no miss spelled words, abbreviations
like on this Document i.e. Subject line.
Opinion..... LIAR AND WANNABE.........
Keep the faith,
The orders are obviously bogus. I doubt his story would hold up to serious
investigation. The picture may be reversed, that would show the ribbons on the
Well as noted, the Mau Mau were in Kenya and no where near South Africa, and
Leopold may exist in (Republic of South Africa) RSA but the one most well known
was Leopoldville which I think was in the Congo when Belgium was the colonial
As for the orders, they are without a doubt phony as can be. Just look at the
signature line and block. They just do not compute. That old boy may have been
in the Army in Korea and Vietnam but he sure did not work where he claimed in
those orders. Moe
- I didn't know that SF had a CG that was a 2-star MG in '63 (Billy Waugh
states we had no Generals at that time and only two Col's and this guy wasn't
one of them).
And since when was War Fare - - as in Special Warfare, 2 words ?????
John Korsbeck SOA 326GL SFA 9366 email@example.com
I normally feel that the phony chase is a waste of energy, but then again if
civilians believe this shit, I bet he wasn't even in the service and is
or has been bamboozling the VA as well. What was he thinking of when he sent
this forward? Hmmm shows that the cranially challenged are stupider than
originally thought. This guy on the other hand could give the deranged and
twisted a bad name. Lets see that would be bad because we are deranged and
twisted; hmmmm jewish lightning, or non descript grey sedan with bull bars
and a foggy night?
These "orders" are a complete fabrication by someone who has no idea what they
are doing .... except lying.
A better understanding of this bullshit artiste is at:
Check out that site. Perhaps our
exposure of this asshole will put his "cave artifacts" into the rock crusher
where they belong. Note that "Special Forces" is only mentioned in his fake bio
at the URL above. However, it gives a great insight into a huckster and his
NeoNazi friends. Suggest that any attempt to discredit this piece of dung be
done in the name of SOA, NOT an individual. We should kick his ass as a group,
to defend the name of all our comrades. However, a single individual does not
need to put up with the kind of attacks this bunch of maggots like to dish out.
For a starter, see the following quote, from the URL above. " McGlone was
concerned with why some believe and behave as they do. Burrows is a liar who
craves attention. Like Collin, he has a uniform fetish (Burrows and Rydholm
1992, see pics on pp. 23 and 30, text on p.23). He also has a penchant for
telling tall tales and once bragged “he was called in by the Air Force to
interrogate UFO witnesses (Heck 2001).” His involvement in financial scams is
well documented. A pathological liar? A master con-artist? In 1995, Burrows
tried his hand at writing again and produced pieces suggesting Carthaginian
pirates were responsible for Burrows Cave (Burrows 1995a), and a non-fantastic
overview of the so-called “Black Hawk War (Burrows 1995c).” To suggest that
Burrows likes to keep busy would be the grossest of understatements."
A Google search on: "Russell Burrows" will give you more information on this
As far as the email you forwarded, it is full of nonsense.
Look at the orders. They are written in Plain Language, something the U.S. Army
was totally incapable of in 1963.
They would have included "EDCSA" or "Effective Date of Change of Strength
Accountability" ... the date one unit would lose him and the other unit would
Also note that he went from Battlefield Commission in 1953, to the rank of COL
O-6 in 1963. I forget the exact Time In Grade requirements for back then, but it
was something like:
2LT to 1LT - 2yrs
1LT to CPT 4 yrs
CPT to MAJ 4 yrs
MAJ to LTC 7 yrs??
Of course, his language is not that which was used back then: "Repatriated to
The heading on the orders are bullshit. Steve Sherman should be able to come up
with the correct heading for Ft. Bragg, about the time these "orders" were
supposedly cut. Note that they are also missing the Office Symbol ... a coded
heading, that should be at the top left of the orders, just above the From/To
information. Note also that the From portion of the orders would not have "MG
...... O-8' The "SB'JT" is also a bullshit abbreviation.
His orders say "currant" duty .... that's a berry ... should be "current." I
have never known a Major General that would sign such a sloppy set of orders
such as these. What's more, normally a MG does not sign the orders. They are
signed by his Adjutant ... "For The Commander" would appear to the upper left of
the signature block.
Then, look at the signature block.... since I joined the military in 1961, we
have NEVER used a signature block like that!! Notice also that "Warfare" is
written "War Fare" in the signature block.
The phrase "These Orders are Top Secret" is also Bullshit.... they would have
simply been stamped "Top Secret," not "These Orders Are ....."
Maybe there is a law, where this scumbag currently lives, that can be used to
punish fakes like him?
Reversing the photo helps. However, the Korean badge above his right pocket
should be centered ... everyone knows this. Also note the lack of Vietnam
service medals/campaign medals, etc.
See my previous reply (above)
I have long wanted to see a Wall of Shame, and not just for Wannabe's ... idjits
like Dr. Chu, the current DoD Personnel liar in chief, and those others who have
screwed soldiers through the years should also be included.
Exposing the fake, the devil is in the paper size
Robert, Another way of exposing the fraud .... get him to show you his
"original" orders. I'll bet they are printed on 8.5" x 11.0" paper (standard
Problem is, the Army used 8" x 10.5" paper for years. I just measured a copy of
orders, from Ft. Bragg, dated 1967, and they are on "Army Size" paper.
I think the story was that the smaller sized paper was supposed to be so that
the paper couldn't be stolen and used by civilians --- there used to be a
training film on the 'so many dollar pencil' (I forget the dollar amount cited).
It was how soldiers thoughtlessly taking pencils home would drain the Army of
precious training dollars, etc.
Anyway, the fake probably did not think to cut his paper down to "Army size."
Thanks again, for all you do.
I'm for the wannabe site. I've busted two people, one saying he was Delta
(through SFA and a Delta contact I confirmed twice that he was not) and the
second guy saying he was a SEAL (I contacted the guys at the SEAL locator and
they said they were 100% certain he was not a SEAL).
Personally, I have never seen orders cut this way. Also, is this guy a General?
Yes, you are correct. His medals and name tag are on reversed sides. Never saw
this guy. Al Doyle
Looks like Bullshit to Me.
John Sending to Lou Faistenhammer.Paul Payne and Charlie Norton for their
"GOD BLESS AMERICA-IN GOD WE TRUST'
I have a good feeling that this is someone trying to pose as a distinguished
combat veteran. Here is just a couple of things that jump out at me.
1. He says he graduated in 1952 and sent to Korea. Since he also states that he
was born in 1935, this would make him either 16 or 17 years old. In 1953 he
states he received a battlefield commission, so he was at best 18? Seems a
little young for that doesn't he?
2. I am very suspicious of the fact he states that he received all of the
following " 1 Bronze Star, 2 Silver stars, 1 Legion of Merit, 2 Purple Hearts"
while still a second lieutenant? Do you know any 2LT who has done that much in
the period of one year (he states he came back in 1953 and was promoted to 1LT).
3. In 1955 he goes to "Advanced Ranger Training in Guerrilla warfare". Since I
wear a Ranger Tab myself, I have never heard of the "Advanced Ranger Training"
course he mentions. Nor in any of my historical readings of the Ranger
Department have I heard mention of an "Advanced Ranger Course."
4. Within the period of one year (1960 to 1961) he states that he applied for,
was accepted, and conducted his SF training, then followed with an assignment to
Saigon. This too does not seem to make sense for the expected timeline of
training (SFQC, language training, etc.)
5. His timeline for promotions does not make sense either. As far as I know,
there were no direct abilities to promote folks past their peers in the early
1960s. If he was a 1LT in 1953, but when he returns in 1963 he was an O-6
(Colonel). When did he work in the Advanced Course (Captain), Command and
General Staff College (Major), and the War College (LTC)?
6. His orders that he shows look nothing like their official and the units
mentioned I cannot cross reference with any of my historical documents which
emulated from Bragg at that time. We all know that the 5th SFG was there, but I
cannot find anything relating to the 5th SOG he mentions. As far as I am aware,
the SOG was stood up in SEA and never had formal ties back to Fort Bragg, NC.
The format does not look like the way I have seen other orders from that time
period beginning. For example the "TOP SECRET" which is on the paper was not
common in those days. I think like the issues with Bush during the last election
and the "forged" performance reports, an expert on writing will tell you the
font and other features were not common to the early 1960s.
Hope this helps. I think that until Mr. Burrows does some more explaining about
his background, he should be treated as a "wanna-be."
|In replying to WhyteEagle, Greg submitted
The statement you reference below is the one I wrote to
Mr. Robert Noe when he asked about this through one of his recent e-mails.
To answer your second question, there are some
additional things I would add.
a. When I went to the MACVSOG website and looked at
the orders he submitted, I noticed that the date of the orders was "5 MAY
1963." I then went to the following website ( http://solarsystem.nasa.gov/calendar/monthly.cfm?Year=1963&Month=5&Audience=SSEP)
and it told me that for 1963, the date in question fell on a Sunday.
I know that Army folks work some long hours, but I think that most
Personnel Actions Centers (PACs) are closed on Sundays, even those PACs 42
b. I have studied, written a few articles, and
lectured about Special Forces, Unconventional Warfare, etc. since 1992.
I have also had the unique opportunity to serve with several "authentic"
MACV-SOG veterans who have shared with me a number of sources to "verify"
actual SOG and 5th SFG (Vietnam) actions. Like I stated in my
original e-mail, the "advanced training" that Mr. Burrows mentions does
not cross reference with articles or actual names course of that
timeframe. For example; then BG William Yarborough mentions in an
article published in the US Army pamphlet entitled "Special Warfare"
(review of this document appeared in the July 1962 Army Information
Digest) that their were unconventional warfare courses and acknowledges
training in areas such Panama (Jungle School, etc.). However, the
name even in 1962 was the "US Army Special Warfare Center" and I can find
no mention of the "US Army Special Forces and Training". Anyone
familiar with Army correspondence will tell you that the letterhead will
ALWAYs have the proper heading for the command it comes from. In
addition, the "Special Warfare" publication I mention acknowledges three
course as of 1962; 1. The Unconventional Warfare Course and 2. the
Counterinsurgency Course, followed by 3. The Psychological Operations
Course. Mr. Burrows should have been a graduate of one of those
c. On / or about the time that Mr. Burrows "orders" were
written I am only aware of the following units at Fort Bragg, NC--1.
The Special Warfare Center, 2. Two Special Forces Groups, the 5th
and 7th (I think that the 3d and 6th were possibly starting to form too),
and 3. Two Psychological Warfare battalions, four psychological
warfare separate companies, and 4. The Special Warfare Training Group
(Special Warfare, pg. 66, 1962). He states he was in Saigon, but
acknowledges no SF unit. Special Forces personnel going in and out
were usually assigned to a "parent unit" such as the 5th or 7th SFG at
Fort Bragg (Archer, "Green Berets in the Vanguard--Inside Special Forces,
1953-1963, pg. 114). Ian Sutherland's "Special Forces of the United
States Army 1952-1982" in the Index of Numbered Organizations only lists
the 5th Special Forces Group.
d. Starting with the letter head and working down,
here are the inconsistencies that I noticed:
documents of those days (as well as today) normally start with "Department
of the Army" followed by in this it should under the Dept of the Army read
something like "Special Warfare Center" etc.
are abbreviations, i.e. FR: (From), DT: (Date), SB'JT (Subject). All
the correspond that I have seen from that era are normally like what I
have seen for example on the Lang Vei After Action Review (22 February
(Office Symbol) 22 February 1968
AFTER ACTION REPORT OF LANG VEI
- In the
paragraph, "currant" is misspelled; I have never seen the C.I.A in any
orders. I don't think that abbreviations have ever been used in
e. Here is the kicker for me--in the signature block
at the very bottom of the page, the signature is blacked out. To the
best of my knowledge Major General Yarorough was the commander during that
time frame at Fort Bragg. You can see some of the signature is
showing and it appears that the last letter is either a "y", "g" or
possibly a "z". Why would MG Yarborough sign the last letter of his
name below the line and assuming it is his signature, have the "g"
appearing after the "h" rather than before?
I hope that this helps you to determine the authenticity of
the claims. From my experience and knowledge, it just does not add
up with the claims being made in his bio and looking at the orders, time
line for training, attaining rank, etc. I would through the bull
poop flag on this until Mr. Burrows shows something a little
more consistent and "official". Maybe if Mr. Burrows is lucky he
could appear in "Stolen Valor--Book II".
Ask yourself this question: Why would the
signature of these orders be blacked out? Never seen that before and there
is no reasons for this other than to ensure Burrows is provided another
1 The photo is reversed - the ribbons are on the wrong side
2 This guy went from 2d Lt (53) to Col 06 in ten years - I doubt it.
3 "Advanced Ranger training in guerilla warfare". The Ranger Course is the
Ranger Course - what shit is this?
4 Get his DD 214 - that will give you his record.
5 That set of orders is so obviously fabricated a village idiot can spot
it. The heading is wrong - Bunny Knowles (the CG's secretary from
Yarborough to probably 1996) would never have typed that! 5th Special
Forces, 5th Special Operations Group (5th S.O.G.) This is an amateurish
Charlie Norton "Fang"
Actually, the time frame is correct for the Mau Mau uprising, which was in
Kenya (I don’t believe the Congo was mentioned). It would have been late
in the insurrection, but within the time frame. Seems to me someone would
know this guy.
Sherman's right. Call Rather and Mapes.
Also look at the photo--it's either a reversed negative or he's got his
ribbons and ID on backwards. I believe it's the latter, as his buttons
appear to be properly aligned (button on right, hole on left).
And there's no "Leopold" in South Africa; it's "Leopoldville" in the
Congo. And no Americans were (could have been) involved in putting down a
so-called National Liberation uprising.
The bio and letter are ridiculous. There are all sorts of misspellings,
invalid terms, and improper abbreviations. What is this guy's IQ? He's got
to have an empty bucket to think that any military man would believe this.
I'll bet this guy is drawing 100% disability for PTSD suffered in Leopold.
Even we Navy guys can see through this one!
Looks bogus to me, however, I am truly not an expert in such matters.
Could the photo be reverse image, thus causing the ribbons to be on the
wrong side (as well as the name tag)? I never saw a name tag with so much
info, though illegible.
Also, the orders seem out of whack with all orders I have seen, and I used
to be a special orders clerk and personnel sergeant briefly, including the
year in question, 1963, but not at Fort Bragg, rather in Germany.
I smell a rat, but could be wrong. Have been before.
This JOKER is a want to be. I do not know what his game is, but would like
to find out. I think that we should send all of his data to the FBI, you
know the one to have him charged and sent on a vacation. With the
decorations that he claims he is another Audie M. I think that someone
with that many awards the press would have his story. I never knew the
First of all never heard of an advanced Ranger training course in guerilla
warfare. However, I believe that the Ranger Association has access to a
list that shows every one whoever completed the Ranger Course and when. He
claims he was reactivated in 1995. As he went out two years before as a
first lt. he would have come back a 1st Lt. then to full bull in 8
years???? Further all classified documents are stamped top and bottom with
the classification of the document. The army does not put a comment at the
bottom of the signature block stating what the classification is. This guy
is off his rocker if he thinks any of us are going to believe him. He is
just another wannabee.
ANYONE, who had spent more then a couple years in the military, would
realize that there are too many poorly created signature blocks and ID
I'm not sure what I am reading here..I sent your mail to a Marine, PT
Hughes and he returned this link, one of many he said. He has a dislike of
people who run around with tin hats and Vietnam stories. I'll let my eyes
rest and go over this one again, but if you hold a Wanabee contest, this
guy Kimball will be up near the top it seems. Nah, Sherman is wrong to
hand this guy over to 60 Minutes. More like Jerry Springer.
John Martin . SOA 345 GL
Robert, I don't think this (he) is for real. 1963 the 5th Gp was still at
Bragg and we did not have a SOG, and most of the TDY teams out of Bragg
came out of the 7th and the 1st in Oki. I have been on a few classified
missions and I have never gotten orders that had top secret as that one.
Taking a second look at the orders there is no Special Order number on
them. This alone tells me that they are fakes
A REAL $3 CONFEDERATE BILL PHONY. I HAVE FRIENDS IN AND AROUND OLNEY, IL,
AND I WILL SEE THAT THE WORD GETS OUT ABOUT THIS PHONY PUKE !!!
CPT, US ARMY(ret)
I DON'T KNOW MUCH, BUT YOU DO KNOW I HAVE ONE OF THOSE SUSPICIOUS NATURES.
WHY IS THE NAME CROSSED OUT WHO ISSUED THE ORDERS? WHY ARE THE ORDERS TOP
SECRET? WHAT IS HE SUPPOSED TO BE A SECRET AGENT? LOOKS LIKE BULLCRAP TO
Fake document. Done on a word processor. The typewriters back then could
not do reduced size superscript.
David G. Mohler, M.D.
Refugee Relief International, Inc.
I wouldn't dignify this phony bastard by commenting on what I think of
Another SICK PUPPY!!!
I haven't had time to make a detailed review of the photo (which may be
reversed), but I do have some questions on the orders. The abbreviations
Subject, Major General are not accurate. Current (currant) is spelled
incorrectly and there are several format discrepancies. I would also
a zip on the letterhead. These may be picky administrative stuff, but
merit looking at.
I don't have the research capability and it was before my time, but I do
not remember any discussion on a "5th S.O.G." ever being Fort Bragg before
during the Vietnam War.
Sent from the Internet (Details)
I also noticed on the "Top Secret" orders there is a misspelling of the
word current. In this "Top Secret" document the word is spelled
currant...as in fruit or berry.
The "Top Secret" looks like the paper that can be purchased from a catalog
Looks suspect to me
Cheers to all,